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It sounds like bull-shit, but has anyone tried out Nanogen's new anti-hairloss concoction, apparently predicated on the idea of using VEGF, rather than minoxidil, to increase blood-supply to hair-follicles?
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Doubt it works -
It promotes "natural hair growth" lol.... see how they word it? Clever buggers.
Its bullshit - I was doing some research on this a few weeks ago and found forum after forum of pissed off users -
Most of the shit out there is using the "sophisticated stem cell" labelling to convince customers its some kind of miricle FDA passed "Histogen style cure".
These ****ers shouldn't be allowed to sell these products without atleast some official clinical proof.Comment
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I think this should also answer your question, 99.9% of companies that use a statement like this are selling snake oil.
Any information found on this site has not been evaluated by the FDA. Our products are not intended to treat, diagnose, or prevent any disease.Comment
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UK, even vitamins and supplements have that on their labels...so all of those are scams?Comment
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I was actually referring to companies selling hair loss products, thought the term "snake oil' would've made that clear.
Vitamins dont make ridiculous claims to regrow hair do they? (Well TRX2 does, but it also has a similar disclaimer as the one shown above
) If this product has not been approved by the FDA - then how on Gods earth do you know it works? Lol. A DIS-claimer is exactly that; telling you their claims are bullshit - it's really that simple.
Just a question, will you be buying this product? If not may I ask why?Comment
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There are vitamins out there that people know of which are essential for aiding in healthy hair growth, but the bottles also state 'statements not approved by FDA' and so on...people have used silica, msm, other multi-vitamins which dont have approval, but thru consumers' trials is how we know they work for some people. Body builders use protein powders which include statements that are not FDA approved, but at the end of the day they build muscle.I was actually referring to companies selling hair loss products, thought the term "snake oil' would've made that clear.
Vitamins dont make ridiculous claims to regrow hair do they? (Well TRX2 does, but it also has a similar disclaimer as the one shown above) If this product has not been approved by the FDA - then how on Gods earth do you know it works? Lol. A DIS-claimer is exactly that; telling you their claims are bullshit - it's really that simple.
Just a question, will you be buying this product? If not may I ask why?
Not claiming that TRX2 works, but the reason it is made as a natural supplement is because going thru FDA trials is too costly and would take forever to get to market. If you owned a company, and you knew that a product could potentially work without having to go through the FDA, would you? No, because as a business you dont want the extra costs. It would be great if everything went thru the FDA, but its not realistic.
I'm not arguing that most of the products out there are not scams, but to be fair, not everything under the sun is. The reason I'm taking TRX2 is because I believe there is something to it. I could give you a few reasons to why I believe it will, but it can be just as easy to negate and dismiss those reasons i.e. Thomas Whitfield has his PhD in this related field from Oxford, backed by other reputable organizations, reasonable explanation of how it works, clinical trials underway and to be released soon, etc, etc.
I will not be trying the nanogen product because, honestly, I have not heard much about it. While it is presented like any other 'treatment' out there, my gut tells me that it won't work. And thats all we can do with products that come out which are not FDA approved...follow your gut and try it to see if it works. If you want things to be FDA approved, then continue balding for another 10 years. At the end of the day, I guess people just want to feel like they are doing something about their hairloss. Ignorance is bliss I suppose.Comment
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I understand what you're saying, but we know protein builds muscle, just as we know caffeine is a stimulant, we wouldn't need to prove such products in terms of efficacy or safety because the ingredients are.... well... just everyday food in a powdered form marketed as an "anabolic muscle-head goon pumper"- or words to that effect, if you even out the serving sizes of a weight gainer and slim fast you'll get pretty much the same intake of protein, carb & fats - its just the label and serving size you're buying into.
Take that same product and put a growth factor/chemical/drug or substance in there and tell me it packs on as much muscle as anabolic steroids - then I wanna see some studies and safety approval of the ingredients or the product before I pay for it - and most muscletech products, as you know always market their bullshit as if they've been studied on x amount of participants yadda yadda yadda - google "Anator" and you'll see what I mean, same shit different day.
I usually take these things at face value, and a disclaimer is a big sign telling me to keep my money in my wallet - and 100% of the time its worked - I mean... if I was wrong I wouldn't be here typing this message would I?, id be in the Maldives on a beach twisting my hair between my fingers under the hot sun
. I get really bitter about this subject, not because ive been duped by one of these scams, but just the way they get your hopes up, build [marketing] hype and 6 months later find out nothing worked.
I mean just look at CyGenX, I nearly pissed myself laughing when I saw their YouTube style marketing bullshit video - and you can tell they were trying to viral this video throughout the entire hair loss community and net a hoard of poor suckers. I understand what you're saying, but id rather end that 10 years and have saved thousands by not buying into unproven treatments, thousands id have to spend on a demonstrable treatment when it arrives. Mind you, this Nanogen is pretty affordable at $109 for a 3 month supply.Comment
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It's not unsurprising that the TRX2 is making bold claims with no grounding in reality. It's creator, Thomas Whitfield, is utterly full of sh*t. So it would go to reason that his product is as well. He claims to be a world renowned expert in hairloss - yet if you do a literature search on him (i have access to strong scientific search engines at work and have done this) you can find nothing. Not a single paper published on hair loss. No talks. No conferences. No books. No interviews. Nada. Zilch. So what, exactly, are Whitfield's criteria for being a world recognized expert? I think using his criteria, anybody on these boards would be consider an expert.I was actually referring to companies selling hair loss products, thought the term "snake oil' would've made that clear.
Vitamins dont make ridiculous claims to regrow hair do they? (Well TRX2 does, but it also has a similar disclaimer as the one shown above) If this product has not been approved by the FDA - then how on Gods earth do you know it works? Lol. A DIS-claimer is exactly that; telling you their claims are bullshit - it's really that simple.
Just a question, will you be buying this product? If not may I ask why?
His main skill seems to be in making tenuous links between some utterly unimpressive work he did as a PhD student and a minoxidil. And exploiting it to make some money off the hopes and desperation of people suffering from an unfortunate condition.
He's been promising data for a long time now and hasn't provided anything. That carrot will always dangle out of reach. And in much the same way, so will the results of all the people who are using his product. Don't worry, haven't seen results in 3 months, many users see at 6 months. Oh, no results at 6 months? Don't worry, some users see at 12. On and on. Just keep buying the product at 60$ a shot.
He's a joke and his product is nothing more than vitamins and AA's you can get off the shelf at GNC. Shame on him.Comment
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Sadly for us trying TRX2 out, I think you've summed him up perfectly.
We live in hope that results will be seen as promised! I personally have paid up for six months and after which if gains aren't apparent, i will not be chasing the dangled carrot no longer. But, what you've said sums him up, pretty sure of it.Comment
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Not sure why you think it's bullshit, unless of course you know nothing about hair loss. There are lots of papers including one from Harvard showing hair growth. What I'm impressed with is that they use actual growth factor (not peptides like all others before them)
I'm defending Nanogen as they seem to be doing some innovative work. I'm sure they want to make a profit but does every drug company. Maybe if people actually did research and properly evaluated the bullshit stuff from the pioneering stuff then good companies would have more research money.
Minoxidil is not so unique anymore. The mechanism of action is known. Growth factors work in a different way. They could work in harmony.
Search VEGF and Harvard.Comment
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I think it's bull-shit because it looks to be another magic-potion item that's marketed with buzzwords like, "V.E.G.F." and "growth factors" — exotic, scientific-sounding terms that land with just enough familiarity on the ears of persons who periodically Google news on hairloss-treatment.
You defer to some papers and imply you have a bit of knowledge (at least more than I) about hairloss; cite the papers and share your knowldge — don't haughtily ask me to search for a couple of terms.
V.E.G.F. works within the body to promote the formation of blood vessels; to my knowledge, no scientific study (to May, 2011) demonstrates that any form of the compound, applied topically or taken orally, is effective in halting or reversing hairloss. Again, if your knowledge outreaches this, back it up.
Finally, the "peptides" you've casually brushed off your shoulder are what compose a great number of "growth factors"; I'm uncertain why you appear to dismiss the former while applauding the latter.Comment
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@hairtalk
I don't want to get into a flaming row. Let's not get personal. I mean disrespect to you. I am a scientist and studied biochemistry.
You replied "I think it's bull-shit because it looks to be another magic-potion item that's marketed with buzzwords like, "V.E.G.F." and "growth factors" — exotic, scientific-sounding terms that land with just enough familiarity on the ears of persons who periodically Google news on hairloss-treatment."
It may look like another potion but it isn't like that. Whilst I understand your frustration (along with mine) at the number of snake oil products, PLEASE do not tarnish this technology with the same brush. VEGF does 100% increase angiogenesis (blood supply proliferation). There is no debate about this. Saying a product contains VEGF or growth factors is not using a buzzword. I fail to see your complaint.
Now peptides are different. This is where your scepticism should be. Most are totally unsuitable and umproven (even in vitro or theoretically). That's the bullshit buzzwords where I share your frustration. Peptide just means small amino acid chains. It's true that growth factors or cytokines are composed of protein like structures but peptide that i meant in the everyday sense in hairloss are all smoke and mirrors in my view. Its ironic and with respect tragic that you buy into peptides but not GF.
If you look at the best argument for peptide mechanism of action, it is actually to mimic growth factors! VEGF is the real thing. I'm passionate as I don't want this technology stiffled by understandable but still misguided cynacism. Just be careful of confusing real growth factor with fake growth factor mimicking peptides. There are also lots of growth factors and you need to be very careful with you use (some upregulate and some downregulate different cellular actions). That's the problem with peptides. They are too broad brush.
As for studies, I was talking to the people at Nanogen at ISHRS and trust me they are serious. Trials are underway but they are not cheap nor fast. Plus you have the dilemma if they work!!! Makes it a drug and therefore can't be sold!! Sometimes informal unpublished studies take place between leading doctors and the word spreads to allow products to sell as cosmetics. I must confess that I never knew about this world until I went there but it makes sense.
If you look at Nanogen growth factor. It's is declared as real VEGF. Not herbal ingredient that increases body production of VEGF or peptide that purports to mimic VEGF. Like Coke, it's the real thing. And synthesised in plants. All very clever stuff that must have cost a fortune. This is very exciting. Maybe other companies are moving in this direction too.
I wish u good wishes as a fellow sufferer navigating the murky snake oil waters.
I can't list papers as no access to pubmed but there are lots including a study by Harvard medical school (or associated hospital). It is very well known that VEGF promotes blood supply.Comment
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Haha. I meant to write "I mean no disrespect". Rubbish at typing!Comment
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We know VEG-F induces angiogenesis and promotes blood supply - but how does this deal with a disease that has its roots in genetics? Kind of like hosing down a carpet to clean it, we know it wont be effective for long (as Minoxidil has shown), and I dont see how this will help grow new hair. We know VegF is upregulated in most cancers, so where is the excessive hair growth in skin cancer?
Also, there are no studies, I couldn't find any, you'd think the company would shove any official studies in the face of consumers, the mere fact that there exists an ambiguity about the claims of this product signals snake oil to me.
HairTalk is right, a lot of companies are using sophisticated "buzz words" to sell their products, none of them work, check out CyGenX to see what I mean, if you're going to use growth factors then alright, lets see some studies into safety and efficacy - what's wrong with demanding that as a consumer? I'm not going to blindly trust some faceless money grabbing corporation am I? - Who would be stupid enough to do that? Too many people have lost out at the hands of these ruthless, vindictive, lying scumbag corporations that sell snake oil on the basis of faith, sorry, I have no faith in any of them until they can prove what they state. I dont blame the people who buy these products, they're desperate and companies exploit that thoroughly, they just need to understand that any product that truly works would be all over "google news" worldwide within a matter of minutes.Comment
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