Histogen Update - Spencer Kobren Speaks With Dr. Craig L. Ziering

[fontanajul]

As dramatic as this sounds, going through this makes me feel so detached from the rest of the world. But having someone that close to the thing we're looking for post and answer our questions really makes me feel better. This forum has really helped me.

-Max

[RichardDawkins]

Thanks guys. Well iam not into this one guy you spoke about. I choose Richard.Dawkins for specific reasons as a user name. The reason is simple, people who are so extremely devoted to god will just let their potential and their ideas slip.

Like someone here said, "christians" discuss about stem cells as if you go to hell when you use them, i say nonsense. A lot of other countries are so far involved in stem cell cures that in lets say three years or so they will make our "technology" obsolete to a certain point, thats for sure.

You can see those impacts these days, no one is really investing any more in our average US/European biotech lab anymore. Instead investors are going to the east. And who can blame them.

If i would be a millionaire and there is someone in the east with a working concept and successul pre trails for lets say a cure for cancer. I would gladly invest in his company rather then some "christian" biotech lab in the bible belt or so.

Another thing we see in europe is the medical tourism. Where people actually travel to other countries to get something fixed or repaired. The sad thing is, over the years more and more of those countries developed higher medical standards whereas the county i live in is pretty much stuck on "theories and concepts".

Let me put it this way if Cooley/Hitzig and Histogen are the asian biotech company then we have FUT-Puppet Pluck surgeons in our country.

Oh and Dr Ziering said something pretty important, to actually educate patients with upcoming treatments today. In germany well they wouldnt tell you anything about Acell even if you would put a gun to their head.

US-Hairloss sufferers should at least be glad to a certain point, theire surgeons are willed to go new ways, even if it would take 2 or 3 years, at least some of them are doing something.

But also the hairloss community has the obligation to educate their surgeons, i send some emails to some surgeons in germany and contacted some via phone. Guess what only ONE was interested in considering Acell. They asked me if i could help them with some informations etc.

The others were not interested or came up with stupid arguments like "This wont work its snake oil"

So i did at least what i could for german hairloss sufferers, i hope you guys get also the motivation to convice your surgeons to use or try or experiment with Acell.

And thanks Dr Ziering for answering the questions here. The interest is actually far beyond everything you can imagine. The same goes for Acell "multiplication"

[matlondon]

I must admit that I am very impressed and delighted with the level of interest and depth of knowledge displayed by this forums posts.
It is great that we all share such passion for hair.
I would like to comment on a few things .
1.HSC is not for sale now and if and when it is , it will have very specific and well substantiated proof for any claims that it makes.
2.I can only speak for myself but I would bet my peers have the same sentiment.
I welcome any product or technique that benefits people suffering from hairloss regardless of its origins.
3.I am in this field because I love it and I have dedicated over 20 years to the field and my patients and maintain that it is a blessing and a priveledge to do what my staff and I do.
4.I am becoming involved with a hair restoration practice in the UK ,and with the help of several of my colleagues we hope to raise the level of care,knowledge and skills in the UK and educate patients about all their options.
I like many of you just hope to have a positive impact on peoples lives.
Thank you for including me in this process.

Doc Z

But if you are involved then you must have a price range for the product?
Hair loss regeneration is a matter of time, i guess companies are rushing to be the 1st to release this product before others to build up a client base and their market share. If this product truely works then more men would seek help. We all know HT is the very last resort and an act of desperation, having a few injections matter of 30 mins +/-. the issue with all the other hair loss products is time consuming and remembering to take the meds etc..

If the product works hair loss centers will be like dental surgeries, you would go in hand over cells come back in 2 week get treated and leave. Freeing up time for both the individual and the doctor, everyone wins.
The reason i know there would be a big demand for a cell based hair regeneration product, like the ones in progress, i have spoken to a few people about hair loss and when i mentioned a couple of injections for reverse hair loss their eyes open up and they all said they would opt for it, and this is from a small sample of 23 men.

[PayDay]

As dramatic as this sounds, going through this makes me feel so detached from the rest of the world. But having someone that close to the thing we're looking for post and answer our questions really makes me feel better. This forum has really helped me.

-Max

It’s not dramatic! The Bald truth show, and this forum have helped my life more then words can describe. Before I found this, I felt very alone and unhappy. Thank you Dr. Ziering for taking the time to help us all out.

[LarryDavid]

Thank you Dr. Ziering for answering questions here.

I have two Question concerning your interview:

1. It has not become clear to me what exactly are the results 2 years after one single injection. I can see pictures on the Histogen website which show the hair growth after 12 weeks, 5 month and 12 month. As i can see in the statistics below the the pictures, after 12 month there is still new and thicker hair growing. Now after 2 years, is there still an increase in numbers of hair and hair thickness? I mean compared to the 1 year update, are there now more and thicker Hairs? Or were the 1 year results just lasting for one more year?

2. Will there be an update on the Histogen website which shows macrophotos and statistics regarding the 2 year results?

[clee984]

Dr, Ziering...if this was Facebook, I would give you a huge "Like". I'm fairly new to hair loss and have some strange lines going on in the back of my head but anyways, just wanted to let you know how appreciative I am for the information and how much you care for people and their hair loss. Thanks!

Dr Zeiring, if this was Facebook, I would give you a huge "like" for having the sign off "Doc Z"! It makes you sound like a comic book supervillian

The stem cell debate always reminds me of the napster controversey: The technology is there. It isn't going to go away just because you click your heels together and say there's no place like home. Trying to deny it or stop it, for religious or any other reasons, helps nobody.

[RichardDawkins]

Yeah but it slows the success down. And this is annoying ;-)

[UK_]

Thank you Dr. Ziering for answering questions here.

I have two Question concerning your interview:

1. It has not become clear to me what exactly are the results 2 years after one single injection. I can see pictures on the Histogen website which show the hair growth after 12 weeks, 5 month and 12 month. As i can see in the statistics below the the pictures, after 12 month there is still new and thicker hair growing. Now after 2 years, is there still an increase in numbers of hair and hair thickness? I mean compared to the 1 year update, are there now more and thicker Hairs? Or were the 1 year results just lasting for one more year?

2. Will there be an update on the Histogen website which shows macrophotos and statistics regarding the 2 year results?

If I could weigh in with my opinion here; I believe after a certain period after the injection there was a drop-off in new hair growth c12 - 16 weeks?, yet any gains remained present for (so far) up to two years.

Which hands down beats Propecia & Minox - treatments that work for c65% of patients, Histogen hit c80% (?) Patients did not need to re-inject for up to two years, as opposed to Propecia and Minox which MUST be taken everyday for as long as you wish to keep your hair. My question to all the sceptics is: Where's the shed? HSC did not induce a shed after discontinuing usage as is commonly associated with Propecia and Minox.

So, taking this into account, they're no longer merely looking at preventing the debilitating impact of DHT or vasodilatation of the scalp to merely 'extend' the lifespan of the hair but actually turning back the clock and recreating what happened during the embryonic phase in which hair follicles were being created for the very first time.

[CVAZBAR]

If I could weigh in with my opinion here; I believe after a certain period after the injection there was a drop-off in new hair growth c12 - 16 weeks?, yet any gains remained present for (so far) up to two years.

Which hands down beats Propecia & Minox - treatments that work for c65% of patients, Histogen hit c80% (?) Patients did not need to re-inject for up to two years, as opposed to Propecia and Minox which MUST be taken everyday for as long as you wish to keep your hair. My question to all the sceptics is: Where's the shed? HSC did not induce a shed after discontinuing usage as is commonly associated with Propecia and Minox.

So, taking this into account, they're no longer merely looking at preventing the debilitating impact of DHT or vasodilatation of the scalp to merely 'extend' the lifespan of the hair but actually turning back the clock and recreating what happened during the embryonic phase in which hair follicles were being created for the very first time.

If turning back the clock is truly the case, it would be something amazing. As much as i want to get excited, something always makes me think, if all this is really possible. Injections to reverse hair loss? Hair multiplication? Are we really going to be a part of this soon? Sometimes i think of hair loss like aging. No matter how much you try, you can't stop from getting old and hair loss seems to be the same. Is an 80 year old man really going to be able to have hair like a 25 year old? Seems impossible but i surely hope and pray this will be possible soon. BTW, if Histogen works for diffuse thinning, does that mean you could inject it anywhere in the head? I was thinking about old people who still have hair on the sides but is real thin. Would it help to keep hair thick from the sides as well?

[CVAZBAR]

Aderans focuses on stem cells whilst Intercytex focused on DP cells, correct me if i'm wrong but I believe there is a difference. Aderans has several protocols and have released mildly promising results from their first protocol, again this is the year for Aderans to show us what they're made of also.

Is Aderans, Follica and Trichoscience the same thing? Is it the same idea? They all seem similar and I keep wondering why none of these ****ers have came out. I haven't heard any news or updates.

[UK_]

If turning back the clock is truly the case, it would be something amazing. As much as i want to get excited, something always makes me think, if all this is really possible. Injections to reverse hair loss? Hair multiplication? Are we really going to be a part of this soon? Sometimes i think of hair loss like aging. No matter how much you try, you can't stop from getting old and hair loss seems to be the same. Is an 80 year old man really going to be able to have hair like a 25 year old? Seems impossible but i surely hope and pray this will be possible soon. BTW, if Histogen works for diffuse thinning, does that mean you could inject it anywhere in the head? I was thinking about old people who still have hair on the sides but is real thin. Would it help to keep hair thick from the sides as well?

Interesting comment, a lot of individuals see it as a far fetched idea that even some day 60 - 70 year old men may have full heads of hair, but it does happen, and therefore if it is physically possible to achieve - in this case then we need to look at the obstacles, overcome them and re-create from the bottom-up what we lost, which is exactly the purpose of 'regenerative' medicine.

The concept of regenerative medicine (as we all know) has attracted a large degree of controversy, and what I am about to say may seem far fetched but do consider it, if in nature certain animals can lose a limb and grow it back within a few days, then it is technically feasible (as we are viewing its occurrence in nature) we just need to find out how it is done and apply it to humans.

[UK_]

Is Aderans, Follica and Trichoscience the same thing? Is it the same idea? They all seem similar and I keep wondering why none of these ****ers have came out. I haven't heard any news or updates.

Aderans focuses on transplanting stem cells from the back of the scalp to balding areas, they have several protocols, Follica keep their cards close to their chest but I believe they are working in the same direction as Histogen by using types of 'gene therapy' to induce follicular neogenesis. Trichoscience seems similar to Intercytex, they may either be working with DP cells or Stem Cells.

Still, Histogen have clearly set a new standard with a 2 year follow-up and no hair loss in any of the patients that were apart of that first 80% circle; I believe Aderans helped 50% maintain new follicles after 1 year and their best protocol worked well (in this sense "noticeable hair gains) in 70% of patients which again lags behind Histogens achievements.

[KeepHoping]

Dr. Ziering

There is a lot of speculation that the histogen product won't work as well for people that have gotten transplants becuase transplants may cause damage or destroy surrounding follicles in the recipient area, I'm not sure if this is the case but if so, do you think Histogen's product would be less effective? And is it actually true that when you transplant hair you are killing the follicles around where they are being placed in the recipient?

In other words is Histogen's HSC dependant on reawakening dormant follicles or is it actually creating brand new follicles is what I'm wondering if you have the answer to. This is very important for people considering hair transplants at this point, especially me with a MPB pattern but with diffuse thinning across the top of the scalp, if your product works by reawakening follicles in their original positions then it could potentially give me my natural head of hair again as I had when I was a kid if it's only creating new ones, it makes no difference and I can go and get a transplant.

Thanks

[UK_]

And is it actually true that when you transplant hair you are killing the follicles around where they are being placed in the recipient? Thanks

That's a good point, you're possibly damaging the still existing stem cells/follicles in the recipient area and also creating scar tissue in the donor area, but the HSC could also be used to stimulate new follicles in the rear of the scalp and have them transplanted to frontal areas. However, the statement of 'creating new hair follicles' is a controversial one; referring to the work by Follica for instance, they stated that even in a scalp that appears literally shining bald, the hair is still present but it is microscopic.

So in that context, another way of looking at how the HSC is working, is not that it is creating new follicles but it is actually kicking those microscopic scalp hairs back into action, which also ties in well with the high degree of "control" the HSC imputes as stated by Dr Ziering, in other words; perhaps the reason he didnt see hair sprouting from the forehead etc is because those stem cells are just not present there. Now you have to question, what is in store for an individual who may have lost those miniaturised stem cells through constant transplants, I hope after Phase II we will gain answers to such questions.

[LarryDavid]

Thanks a lot for answering my questions. I´m looking forward to the 4 weeks update and thank you for sharing this with the community.

I have one more question:
If HSC only stimulates the existing hairfollicles (not creates new follicles) to grow new hair, I assume that you can even build a natural Hairline with HSC because (for example) if u inject the HSC on the forehead, there would be no terminal hairgrowth.

I hope you understand what i mean