The Non-Disclosure Agreement Thread

[Still-Researching]

Originally Posted by amadeus

Again, as I wrote, this is common practice in all physician patient, arbitration matters or one on one refund negotiation agreements. Once the person accepts the refund they have to sign away their rights to publically discuss the matter. Actually this is true for any legal settlement of any kind in the U.S. It's not about being right or wrong, it’s just the way this country runs. If you don't agree with it don't have surgery in this country.

And if you do have a bad outcome and haven't signed an agreement prohibiting you from discussing a bad outcome publically prior to surgery, just don’t ask for a refund and post away. It’s your choice, you do not have to sign anything.

Exactly.

It is not NDAs that are the problem it is a choice of a bad doctor to begin with. NDAs are common in US for top docs and bad docs. In Europe it is different, but nevertheless you should spend your time researching the doc.

[ejj]

And if you do have a bad outcome and haven't signed an agreement prohibiting you from discussing a bad outcome publically prior to surgery, just don’t ask for a refund and post away. It’s your choice, you do not have to sign anything.[/QUOTE]


hyperthetically speaking of course ` posting wouldnt pay for the huge repair costs though ! `

[amadeus]

You’re right, but you’re the one making that choice. If you want to receive a refund or greater compensation, then you’ll have to sign a standard settlement agreement. If it’s more important for you to post about your experience then don't accept the compensation.

Originally Posted by ejj

And if you do have a bad outcome and haven't signed an agreement prohibiting you from discussing a bad outcome publically prior to surgery, just don’t ask for a refund and post away. It’s your choice, you do not have to sign anything.

hyperthetically speaking of course ` posting wouldnt pay for the huge repair costs though ! `[/QUOTE]

[chrisis]

Originally Posted by Still-Researching

Again never spoke to anyone or read on any forum that any of the European Top Docs would require that, so never seen it as an issue.

Aware that this is common and by law in the US, but if you are against it - guess you should not go to a US doctor then.

I spend 30 minutes reading carefully through the documentation that was provided for my HT and it was very standard, and most was N/A because i was having FUE and such complications could only happen in case of FUT.

Research - Research - Research... If you find a top doc - this is a non issue in my view.

Complications can happen with FUE. You still scar. You may get a low yield. They may **** up your hair line. etc. etc.

Maybe I'm being too ideological here, but shouldn't doctors seek to address patient concerns because they care about their wellbeing? Asking them to sign a non-disclosure suggests that isn't as important as the doctor receiving negative publicity. Can't a doctor have confidence in his work to not need this crutch? It may be common practise, but is it ethical practise?

[amadeus]

That’s right. You can have a bad outcome from any type of surgery, there are no guarantees. Doctors in every field of medicine protect themselves from liability. If you were a doctor who spent years in school, with a family to support and a good reputation to protect, don't you think you would take the same precautions? Think about it.

Originally Posted by chrisis

Complications can happen with FUE. You still scar. You may get a low yield. They may **** up your hair line. etc. etc.

Maybe I'm being too ideological here, but shouldn't doctors seek to address patient concerns because they care about their wellbeing? Asking them to sign a non-disclosure suggests that isn't as important as the doctor receiving negative publicity. Can't a doctor have confidence in his work to not need this crutch? It may be common practise, but is it ethical practise?

[gmonasco]

Originally Posted by amadeus

That’s why every patient should ask to see all paper work before the day of the surgery. Take your time and read through everything and if you don't like what you see, don't sign the documents.

As well:

a) If you're going to spend several thousand dollars on cosmetic surgery that will permanently alter your appearance, it's well worth your while to a spend an extra hundred or two to have a lawyer review the paperwork first so that you fully understand all the implications of what you're signing. Most standard business contracts are woefully one-sided in favor of the parties that issue them.

b) Nothing mandates that you accept a contract on a "take it or leave it" basis -- you can require that certain provisions be eliminated or changed before you will sign it. The other party may not agree to your changes, but if you make it clear that they won't get your business without them, then you have more leverage in ensuring that the contract represents your interests as well.

[chrisis]

Originally Posted by amadeus

That’s right. You can have a bad outcome from any type of surgery, there are no guarantees. Doctors in every field of medicine protect themselves from liability. If you were a doctor who spent years in school, with a family to support and a good reputation to protect, don't you think you would take the same precautions? Think about it.

A good doctor who cares about the well being of his patients doesn't need to worry about whether they are "disclosing" the details of their surgery!!!

I understand other precautions, but this type of surgery is undertaken because someone wants to look better. It's not the same as a heart bypass where the doctor can be liable for killing people.

If someone feels unhappy with the result of their procedure, then I think it's shady to ask them to sign a non-disclosure in return for recompense, so that the doctor's name isn't tarnished. That's my opinion. I don't care what the common practise is.

[amadeus]

Good points gmonasco. Both the doctor and the patient have choices. Either can decide not to move forward if they choose, and patients do have the right to negotiate the terms of the contract. If a patient is naive enough to think that they are not entering into a legally binding contract when they are being treated in any manner by a physician, then considering elective surgery is a huge mistake.

The emotional nature of this type of surgery alone lends it self to secure even more liability protection for a doctor. These doctors only have to read these forums to see the massive emotional instability that permeates these places. I'm surprised they don't go to work wearing a suit of armor.

Originally Posted by gmonasco

As well:

a) If you're going to spend several thousand dollars on cosmetic surgery that will permanently alter your appearance, it's well worth your while to a spend an extra hundred or two to have a lawyer review the paperwork first so that you fully understand all the implications of what you're signing. Most standard business contracts are woefully one-sided in favor of the parties that issue them.

b) Nothing mandates that you accept a contract on a "take it or leave it" basis -- you can require that certain provisions be eliminated or changed before you will sign it. The other party may not agree to your changes, but if you make it clear that they won't get your business without them, then you have more leverage in ensuring that the contract represents your interests as well.

[chrisis]

Are you guys intentionally doing this? I'm at a loss to explain why you guys keep talking about agreements BEFORE the patient has had surgery, when I've stated several times quite clearly that I'm referring to agreements drawn up when a patient is unhappy and a compromise is being reached in the form of compensation or repair surgery.

Please keep to the topic and stop confusing it with irrelevant remarks.

[didi]

Interesting topic, big white elephant in da room

it explains why we dont see many bad results from HT, patient receives partial refund and nobody ever knows..only top results get publicity..

Back in 2001 I received full refund from advanced hair studio(failed laser treatment), almost 4k...I had to sign some papaers which I believe was NDA..I never told anyone as I was happy to get all money back, these agreements are more common than we think

Of course this NDA was AFTER, in presence of their lawyer


I wonder how often does it happen with surgeons of good reputation?