Let's just hope baldtapranost can buy us some time until histogen hits the market.
I need a breathing machine for my follicles otherwise they won't make it "when the saving is here".
If these companies could reveal their formulas for the vehicle we could easily make these stuff with the help of the chinese same as RU or CB.
Just pray baldtapranost reveals their study after phase 2 is done.
05-31-2012 07:46 AM
Davey Jones
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeahyeahyeah
The problem is, what is stopping people who use for their eye lashes to buy the MPB version - given it is cheaper?
Not much. I'm sure they'll attempt to market them as different. Maybe slap "Version not to be used on eye lashes" on the MPB one. And to be fair, they might be different concentrations. I doubt many people will want to fool with diluting just for better lashes. Don't only rich b*tches buy that stuff anyway?
If they can't separately market them, hopefully they'll just market the MPB one, 'cause they know darn well there's more money in that if it works.
05-31-2012 08:01 AM
Maradona
I have an army of 10 raging bald men full of testosterone who have contacted me and are willing to take over histogen's headquarters in asia.
Come on guys let's make this happen kinda like vietnam bald men vs. histogen in singapore.
Not much. I'm sure they'll attempt to market them as different. Maybe slap "Version not to be used on eye lashes" on the MPB one. And to be fair, they might be different concentrations. I doubt many people will want to fool with diluting just for better lashes. Don't only rich b*tches buy that stuff anyway?
If they can't separately market them, hopefully they'll just market the MPB one, 'cause they know darn well there's more money in that if it works.
I'm pretty sure that Allergen is testing 3 formulations that are all stronger than the version that is available for eyelashes. Also I read somewhere that the patent for the eyelash version will end in 2013 so it would only make sense to develop a stronger version for MPB.
05-31-2012 09:12 AM
Davey Jones
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maradona
I have an army of 10 raging bald men full of testosterone who have contacted me and are willing to take over histogen's headquarters in asia.
Come on guys let's make this happen kinda like vietnam bald men vs. histogen in singapore.
This may be the first time we've ever agreed on anything, Maradona. Where do I sign, Sarge?
05-31-2012 10:24 AM
UK_
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcm800
Hey UK how's the Minox going? Been on it some time now, if still using it?
I stopped taking cause the shed was unbearable lol.
How about yourself? Did it help the hair line?
06-01-2012 02:49 AM
LPSboxing
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maradona
I have an army of 10 raging bald men full of testosterone who have contacted me and are willing to take over histogen's headquarters in asia.
Come on guys let's make this happen kinda like vietnam bald men vs. histogen in singapore.
yeah and they (we) don't even need helmets like in the picture. We just spray paint our bald heads with green paint :cool:
06-01-2012 05:00 AM
Maradona
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davey Jones
This may be the first time we've ever agreed on anything, Maradona. Where do I sign, Sarge?
You guys took it the wrong way and I was exaggerating a bit too but all I am saying is the sooner you get Histogen's treatment the better it will be.
Bald scalps are pretty much incurable in my opinion and I know it's painful to hear it.
This is why I think we need to get off our asses and do something about histogen. Sure our sons will benefit but how about us?
We need to DECLARE WAR on histogen .
Balding men vs. Histogen !!
I don't know how do we sign up maybe spencer or somebody can contact the doctor who did this small study. I think he was a doctor outside the clinical trials of histogen, so this should be reachable.
I am sure this doctor is saving a few of bald asses maybe friends who knows.
We also need to find out how expensive it is to produce this.
06-01-2012 05:46 AM
BoSox
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maradona
Bald scalps are pretty much incurable in my opinion and I know it's painful to hear it.
Aderans is coming out with hair cloning, just an FYI.
06-01-2012 06:40 AM
yeahyeahyeah
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Aderans is coming out with hair cloning, just an FYI.
Bitmopost will be coming out too
06-01-2012 06:57 AM
BoSox
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeahyeahyeah
Bitmopost will be coming out too
Will they will even make any money? Their product better show some incredible results with Aderans and Histogen coming out around the same time.
06-01-2012 08:18 AM
BoSox
..also, people are saying Bitamopost's results are nothing major. I hope they are wrong.
06-01-2012 10:12 AM
yeahyeahyeah
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Will they will even make any money? Their product better show some incredible results with Aderans and Histogen coming out around the same time.
Probably better then minox.
If so, may as well use that to maintain.
06-01-2012 10:13 AM
john2399
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Aderans is coming out with hair cloning, just an FYI.
I feel like aderans is going to take so long because hair cloning is going to take a long time to perfect. I think histogen will be the answer for now to atleast save us time for a better treatment or even a true cure in aderans or replicel. Histogen is def the answer for now thou and i agree with maradona, we need this now!!!!!!
06-01-2012 10:15 AM
Baldy6
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
Will they will even make any money? Their product better show some incredible results with Aderans and Histogen coming out around the same time.
Around what time is that? the year 3007? lol
06-01-2012 10:18 AM
yeahyeahyeah
Quote:
Originally Posted by john2399
I feel like aderans is going to take so long because hair cloning is going to take a long time to perfect. I think histogen will be the answer for now to atleast save us time for a better treatment or even a true cure in aderans or replicel. Histogen is def the answer for now thou and i agree with maradona, we need this now!!!!!!
Well they have a timeline.
And are nearly finishing phase 2, I am very sure they will come out before histogen.
2015 the latest imo
06-01-2012 10:25 AM
john2399
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeahyeahyeah
Well they have a timeline.
And are nearly finishing phase 2, I am very sure they will come out before histogen.
2015 the latest imo
Histogen always has the potential to come out in asia or somewhere thou. I just don't know if i believe aderans timeline but i hope it is 2015.
06-01-2012 10:48 AM
BoSox
You all can officially stop stating that Aderans is going to come out later, they have a timeline.. they have their data, and they have their proof that it works.
It's coming 2014 -15. Accept and get over it.
06-01-2012 09:31 PM
Kiwi
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSox
You all can officially stop stating that Aderans is going to come out later, they have a timeline.. they have their data, and they have their proof that it works.
It's coming 2014 -15. Accept and get over it.
Good call BoSox.
All that I'll add to this is that the race must be on, with Histogen running a close second, and Replicell way back in third :)
06-01-2012 09:49 PM
john2399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwi
Good call BoSox.
All that I'll add to this is that the race must be on, with Histogen running a close second, and Replicell way back in third :)
Why are you happy replicel is way back in third....even thou replicel is still in the beginning of their work, they still have the best shot to be the best cure. Histogen is going to be great and i think we all can get histogen treatment with great results until replicel comes out with something that can stop baldness for good.
06-01-2012 09:52 PM
Kiwi
Quote:
Originally Posted by john2399
Why are you happy replicel is way back in third....even thou replicel is still in the beginning of their work, they still have the best shot to be the best cure. Histogen is going to be great and i think we all can get histogen treatment with great results until replicel comes out with something that can stop baldness for good.
Who said I was happy? Maybe in a perfect world Replicel would be first and then Histogen and then Aderans. But right now I don't give a shit.
To be honest I have a bad feeling about Replicel and have a suspicion that they won't be able to make it do what they want it to do.
In my dream world something capable of arresting my hairloss would be available tomorrow :P
06-02-2012 02:14 AM
thechamp
Bitmopost
Bitmopost any idea of the relase date
06-02-2012 05:07 AM
Pate
Quote:
Originally Posted by yeahyeahyeah
The problem is, what is stopping people who use for their eye lashes to buy the MPB version - given it is cheaper?
You think they'll care if they get a viable MPB treatment? I doubt it - the market for longer eyelashes is much smaller than the market for MPB!
There is also the fact the MPB treatment, if it works, will probably be significantly higher concentration. Might not even be safe to be putting that stuff on eyelashes due to the known effects of bimatoprost on the eye itself, so they might still get away with marketing them separately.
06-02-2012 05:33 AM
PinotQ
Based on the links at the bottom of the post the 2 current Phase II trials will end in July and then the results will be available near the end of 2012. If results are positive, Allergan will gear up for Phase III immediately so they may be able to begin Phase III in very early 2013. In fact, the quote in the CBS link below suggests that Phase III could start to be geared up well prior to the end of Phase II.......i.e. as soon as they "start getting any positive feedback". But as Scott Whitcup (head of R&D) says in the transcript, two Phase III trials will be required. What is not addressed is whether those trials can run concurrently, although I see no reason why they can't as I have read about other companies running trials concurrently. Phase II began in June of 2011 and will end in July 2012 so you would have to estimate at least a year for Phase III. If the two Phase III trials ran concurrently and began in early 2013, it is conceivable that Phase III could be completed in early 2014. Assuming negligible side effects on a par with what they had w/ Latisse which has already been approved, you could probably expect quick approval from the FDA so I would say mid to late 2014 at best or 2015 is a reasonable possibility.
I am not sure what the possible side effects of a prostaglandin analog are in general but I would guess that one of the big safety issues would concern whether when going from 1 drop on each eyelid to coverage of the entire scalp, there might be a much greater chance of a toxic level of systemic absorption. However, it appears that "Bimatoprost undergoes minimal systemic absorption" http://www.drugs.com/pregnancy/bimat...phthalmic.html and since Allergan has already cleared Phase I, this issue may not turn out to be a problem.
ALLERGAN EARNINGS CALL Transcript (August 2011):Larry, clearly, this is a program that we've optimally resourced, given the huge market potential. So the Phase I was just testing the overall formulation, making sure that it was stable, making sure that it was tolerated. So we probably have some of the Phase I data at R&D Day. But it's really the Phase II data that will be proof of concept. That depending on enrollment and feedback probably won't be available till end of sort of, I'd say, latter part of next year. Clearly, we'll be monitoring this and as we start getting any positive feedback, we'll gear up, so that once we get the proof of concept data, we could go to Phase III right away. The good news is that the FDA regulatory pathway is well delineated as there are other products that have been approved. The negative is it's not quick. You've got to go through all of the steps that FDA requires and that will be 2 Phase III trials following a proof of concept study. And as you pointed out, we see a potential market, not only for male-pattern baldness which is a huge market, but the animal data suggests that for female hair thinning, that could be a very beneficial product as well.
See also http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-42849516/allergans-potential-baldness-cure-clears-one-hurdle-heads-for-the-hard-part/ suggesting an earlier possible release date in 2013 or 2014.
06-04-2012 09:49 AM
inkt2002
Does anyone know if Histogen is suppose to work on DUPA?
06-04-2012 09:50 AM
Jcm800
Quote:
Originally Posted by inkt2002
Does anyone know if Histogen is suppose to work on DUPA?
Dupa means arse in Polish lol.
06-04-2012 01:45 PM
2020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jcm800
Dupa means arse in Polish lol.
arse means ass in American :cool:
yeah it should work for DUPA, why wouldn't it?
06-05-2012 03:55 AM
tizzle
Im confused, do you want to use histogens HSC to grow a hairy ass? :D
06-07-2012 08:53 PM
john2399
What ever happened to that interview we were going to get?
06-07-2012 09:02 PM
Kiwi
Quote:
Originally Posted by john2399
What ever happened to that interview we were going to get?
Primary Outcome Measures:
Systemic safety measures will be assessed by measuring vital signs, adverse experiences, laboratory tests (hematology, clinical chemistry and urinalysis)and immunological response (anti-drug antibodies) [ Time Frame: Clinically significant change from screening visit to Week 12 ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ]
Non-vellus hair counts [ Time Frame: Change from Baseline to week 12 in treatment areas ] [ Designated as safety issue: No ]
Secondary Outcome Measures:
Hair Thickness Density [ Time Frame: Change from Baseline to week 48 in treatment areas ] [ Designated as safety issue: No ]
Local safety measures will be assessed by clinical exam of treatment areas and monitoring adverse events [ Time Frame: Clinically significant change from Screening visit to Week 48 ] [ Designated as safety issue: Yes ]
Enrollment: 56
Study Start Date: December 2011
Estimated Study Completion Date: December 2012
Estimated Primary Completion Date: June 2012 (Final data collection date for primary outcome measure)
06-10-2012 05:58 AM
Artista
Hey PinotQ -great info
Im looking into it..a possible intermediate treatment til the long term regenerative treatments arrive.
10-18-2012 11:01 AM
534623
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Craig Ziering
Histogen's HSC study showed a statistically significant increase in the number of terminal hairs and hair thickness at 12 weeks. At the five month timepoint there was a decrease in hairs in a number of patients, but a significant increase again at 12 months, with the number of new hairs again reaching statistical significance at one year. There were approximately 25 new hairs per 0.1cc injection and the treatment effect was seen within 2mm of the injection site.
The HSC works by stimulating stem cells in the dermal papilla of the hair follicle to grow new hairs. It also seems that stem cells in the scalp can be stimulated to grow into new hair follicles. This has been shown to be possible in the mouse model using the components that are part of HSC and so Histogen's trial really substantiates in patients with male pattern baldness what has been shown to be possible in mice for the past few years.
Doc Z
Tomorrow, Friday, October 19, 2012 (10:18AM-10:30AM),
Dr. Gail Naughton is going to present the following topic at the currently running ISHRS meeting:
I think the presented data during the SID meeting needs CLARIFICATION, because, as you can see (and review) yourself, the presented data simply DON’T reflect the reality!
Hopefully (maybe?) Dr. Ziering can chime in here to answer as well ... :rolleyes:
10-18-2012 04:22 PM
The Alchemist
Quote:
Originally Posted by 534623
Tomorrow, Friday, October 19, 2012 (10:18AM-10:30AM),
Dr. Gail Naughton is going to present the following topic at the currently running ISHRS meeting:
I think the presented data during the SID meeting needs CLARIFICATION, because, as you can see (and review) yourself, the presented data simply DON’T reflect the reality!
Hopefully (maybe?) Dr. Ziering can chime in here to answer as well ... :rolleyes:
WTF is this? You throw a bunch of random circles around some of the hairs and then declare the analysis no good? You're a joke. Take your unscientific analysis and go back hairsite, Ironman.
10-18-2012 05:08 PM
clarence
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Alchemist
WTF is this? You throw a bunch of random circles around some of the hairs and then declare the analysis no good? You're a joke. Take your unscientific analysis and go back hairsite, Ironman.
What do you mean random? The only random about it is that he's being a bit selective about the distinctions, for example, 9, 28, and 56 appear to have improved while 18, 37, and 38 appear to have weakened, even though all of these targets were marked as "unchanged". Also, his analysis doesn't take into account hairs per follicle; we see, for instance, that 55 has progressed from slick bald to 2 hairs, while 41 has still hair growing out of it albeit one less than before. Some hairs have even had considerable change while not even having circles around them (ie. the two hair follicle between 34 and 35 has thinned).
But in the end, that's just hair-splitting; I don't see what the improvement is in s2018, and we are confused as to what Histogen wants to prove by publishing such an image, or how the measurements relate to the image. Oh well, I think I'm getting a hair transplant!
10-18-2012 06:30 PM
hellouser
Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence
The only random about it is that he's being a bit selective about the distinctions, for example, 9, 28, and 56 appear to have improved while 18, 37, and 38 appear to have weakened, even though all of these targets were marked as "unchanged".
Perhaps it has something to do with growth stages for those hairs that have weakened? As in, maybe those hair recently shed and are in the early stages of growing back?
Just throwing it out there, although it is an interesting observation that some weakened... but if the overall effect is greater thickness, density but especially regrowth, it shouldnt matter TOO much.
10-18-2012 08:45 PM
The Alchemist
Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence
What do you mean random? The only random about it is that he's being a bit selective about the distinctions, for example, 9, 28, and 56 appear to have improved while 18, 37, and 38 appear to have weakened, even though all of these targets were marked as "unchanged". Also, his analysis doesn't take into account hairs per follicle; we see, for instance, that 55 has progressed from slick bald to 2 hairs, while 41 has still hair growing out of it albeit one less than before. Some hairs have even had considerable change while not even having circles around them (ie. the two hair follicle between 34 and 35 has thinned).
But in the end, that's just hair-splitting; I don't see what the improvement is in s2018, and we are confused as to what Histogen wants to prove by publishing such an image, or how the measurements relate to the image. Oh well, I think I'm getting a hair transplant!
Look at the area surronding circle 13, it looks nothing like the early photo.
There is a follicle between 20 and 21 that he didn't even bother to count
which is substantially thicker than before.
9 is thicker yet buttmunch counted it as unchanged
19 appears entirely different
To the left of 26 there are 3 follicles that have all increased dramatically in size and were completely ignored.
Over circle 25 there are hairs that are substantially larger which he didn't bother to count.
There are hairs to the upper left of circle 76 which are much larger
Etc.. Etc.. Etc..
His analysis is piss poor.
10-18-2012 09:17 PM
534623
Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence
Some hairs have even had considerable change while not even having circles around them (ie. the two hair follicle between 34 and 35 has thinned).
Correct. I couldn't make circles around ALL follicular units, because ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by drcole
What’s going on here? It’s certainly not classic androgenic alopecia where the affects are more diffuse. One does not see something like this in an area affected by androgenic alopecia.
That means, the observation area (treated area) has too dense hair in BOTH pics in general - something one indeed does not see like this "in an area affected by androgenetic alopecia". In fact, the pics just show a completely normal circulating (anagen-catagen-telogen-anagen etc) observation area - nothing more nothing less!
And even there is a way to encircle ALL follicular units (you guys can do this anyhow and use the existing circles and numbers as orientation!) - you simply CAN'T see "statistically significant improvement". I mean, idiots can always see improvement if they WANT (or need) to see "improvement".
10-18-2012 10:15 PM
maxhair
Histogen photos always look a bit less impressive than the regrowth percentage stats they're claiming, and when you consider they're only showing the best photos, I think we're in for a disappointing reality check if it does ever come to market. Let's hope two or more of these new treatments are compoundable with each other or with existing treatments.
10-19-2012 08:38 AM
2020
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxhair
Histogen photos always look as bit less impressive than the regrowth percentage stats they're claiming, and when you consider they're only showing the best photos, I think we're in for a disappointing reality check if it does ever come to market. Let's hope two or more of these new treatments are compoundable with each other or with existing treatments.
20% density increase versus 74% that they list on their main page. They always try to show of their BEST result. 20% is still pretty good for just a couple injections.
They need to release the pictures from their independent studies!
